The MakeMeThinner Support Forum

[DogMa]

OK, guys, I know it's easier said than done, but maybe it's time to be a little more assertive. Dutch, if you were deathly allergic to the gravy or anything else they were serving, would you just accept the plate and eat it? Or would you speak up?? And Nicks, just as YOU wouldn't be thinking that about a fat person being on a diet, I doubt they would, either. Most likely they'll think, "Good for her!" or "I wish I had that kind of willpower." And heck, who cares what they think, anyway? It's food. Do what's best for you and your health, and don't let other people derail you. (And once again, what kind of example is that to set for your girls? It may seem small, but it's important that they grow up seeing their mom stand up for herself and taking care of herself and not worrying so much about what everyone else will think. How do you think we got our bad self-images in the first place?)

OK, speech done.

[DutchChoc]

Yes, Robin, of course you're right, especially where the part comes in about what other people will think, which should be the least of my worries. Maybe, deep down at a subconscious level, it becomes, for me, "what can i get out of this excuse to eat which i can blame on them?" I don't have to worry much about being different because I already know they tend to pick on me no matter what. Thanks for the opportunity to poise a different strategy. I will be the one to blame if i come away from there fatter, too.

[nickieluv]

A very good speech, Robin. You're right, people-pleasing to my own detriment is part of what got me fat in the first place. Not that it was literally about food, then, but doing so much for other people, eating when I was alone became the only thing I felt I could do for myself. After all, people have to eat, so who could begrudge me taking time to eat? Someone could, however, have complained that I was spending too much time reading or whatever other 'selfish' thing.

I was kind of approaching it from the 6&0 standpoint, I guess. It might be hard to eat nothing while there, and of course with the time I'd be there I would have to have at least one MF meal, which might spur comments. So I will plan right now to have a L&G. The menu is being sent around through e-mail as people chime in with what they're bringing - so we can wait till last to respond and then bring something that will work for me. No one will care what I put on my plate, and if I eschew dessert there probably will be people who notice but why do I care?

I care because - what if I fail? Then I'll see these same people next year, still fat, and they will think 'what was the point of that damn diet thing last year, she didn't lose any weight.' Although I suppose they won't even care about that, either. People are all wrapped up in themselves (obviously I am!) so I really don't need to worry about them at all.

Good point about the message it would send my kids if I ate differently because of peer pressure or whatever. I told my daughter yesterday that I was 'off my Medifast' for the day, and then this morning she offered me some of her orange and I told her I couldn't because I was having my Medifast again today. I wonder what message that is really sending her?

I was thinking about my eating yesterday (and there was more, after I posted - made a food run when I should have just gone to bed) and I have so far only gone 3 days on plan before going off. So I'm going to set a goal for myself initially of making it twice that - 6 days - before going off again. I am curious to see if by that 6th day I am feeling differently about going off at all. I feel like I have not really committed as much as I thought I had, since looking back I've only been on 3 days, off 1, then on 3 days, off 1. Not a great track record. Time to get a bit more serious.

[SuzyQ66]

Nickie....I am so happy for yout 12.5 pound weight loss. Great job girl!! See you did it and can do it!!

Glad to hear that your daughter is okay. I know how scary that can be. One of my older daughters has been going through stomach problems the majority of the year. We are heading to a second GI doc this week. She will probably need to be scoped again...had one in May. They did find that she has gastritis but it was minor compared to the pain she experiences. Some day I hope they either find the cause..or it just disappears.

I would like to chime in about the holidays. You have to determine what is more important for you....eating food that will give you comfort for 5 minutes and then guilt for the rest of the day...or continuing to lose weight and become healthy. I celebrated Christmas with the in-law today. If you read my post from today...you will find out what happened....but in the end I just ate a MF bar.

[nickieluv]

Today was not a good day. The sky was bound to fall eventually, and it did. I was flirting with disaster allowing myself so much off plan food, and today I was done in and didn't get past 3 meals on plan before plotting my off-ness.

I just keep kicking myself down. My first 3 days on plan were great, almost effortless, things were rolling along - and then I have a cheat day because I want to prove that I am different from every body else and can cheat without consequences. So that cheat day has consequences on the scale, but I get right back on - have a bit tougher time that next three days, but I make it, and then have another cheat day using the excuse of stress about my daughter and wanting to have a fun day with her afterwards - like that HAD to include food. And today was supposed to be day 1 again, but all that cheating (and, I bet, all that diet soda - I didn't think it affected my hunger and I doubt it does, but it seems like it made it harder to not have cravings - stop saying 'I told you so,' Leigh, I can hear you all the way over here! ) left me in a weaker place and I (pretty willingly, I'll grant) succumbed to temptations.

I am NOT different than everyone else here. Not when it comes to how MF works. The plan was tested and has even been refined a few times, all to make it better, perhaps easier and safer to follow, and maybe somewhere out there is a person who cheated every 3rd or 5th or 10th day and still lost a ton of weight, but I'm starting to seriously wonder, if that person does indeed exist, if s/he is not simply a blimp again at this moment, having changed nothing long-term and learned no lessons.

It's not going to be easy. I can't make it easy. Nothing worth having is going to come easy in life, anyway. The things that do come easy, you don't appreciate enough, and don't hang on to and protect with enough vigor. If I did succeed, and find a way to 'effortlessly' lose 100 pounds, the pounds would just come back. After all, if it's so easy to lose them once, it would be easy to lose them a hundred times over, and what would be the reason to try hard to stay thin, if you could just magically get thin again whenever you wanted to?

Hard work is something I will do when it's required of me. I procrastinate like hell, but I can't think of a time when I just plain didn't do something because it was too hard or too inconvenient, not when people were counting on me, or my reputation was on the line. That said, I'm not used to hard work. I've done things others would consider hard work, but I just did them because they needed to be done and that was that. Nothing has required such a full-time commitment from me (other than pregnancy and raising kids) as this diet has. I can have an off day, but it is the height of arrogance to think I can control it, plan it, set it in motion, and put a stop to it. Maybe that's what this is all about. I want to assert my control over food. And I tell myself that by cheating on this diet, I am proving that I am in control. But all it keeps proving is that I can TEMPORARILY keep control, by sheer force of will - or actually, the APPEARANCE of control, because literal control would be not cheating in the first place.

I still am not hopeless. I still know I can do this. 'Terminal uniqueness,' Biki used to say that I suffered from that. Never more so than right now. I, and only I, have the secrets. I, and only I, can mold MF and change it, because obviously I, and only I, know more than a hundred doctors and scientists. I am not even the expert on myself, let alone MF.

I am not different than everyone else. That works both ways. It means that I will not succeed if I cheat - just like everyone else. But it also means that I WILL succeed if I follow the rules - just like everyone else. Look at SuzyQ, Leigh and Shane, Keri - the maintainers, Robin, Lizabette, Lauren, Tawanda - you are all doing it, have done it, by following the rules. I don't see anyone here posting about how they eat out once a week and still have great numbers - and yet I wish to be that person. That person might exist somewhere, but I should have enough evidence by now to know that I am not her.

And consider the lucky person who can eat all she wants and not exercise and still be thin. The odds are that even that person will gain weight in the end as aging makes changes happen to metabolism and muscle mass and things like that. No one can have the fairy tale forever. Hollywood stars, even with all their money, still have to do the work to look the way they do. No amount of surgery can give you the perfect body - you have to have an eating and exercise plan to make it happen. Sure they can hire cooks and personal trainers - they have advantages - but they still have to make a commitment to health and fitness.

I am just like everyone else. I am human. I am flawed. But I am strong. And I can do whatever I put my mind to. So long as I am focused on being able to cheat, I will keep cheating. When I can shift the focus to a more positive effort, then I will reap the positive results.

I need new visuals. No more food fantasies.

I need shopping fantasies. Even closet shopping. That's a good one. And shoe fantasies - being able to wear ankle boots, calf-height boots, those damn sexy things I can't squeeze myself into right now.

Open-air fantasies. Running in the yard, chasing my daughter, catching her and collapsing in a pile of grass or leaves, laughing and hugging, swinging her up and around in my arms effortlessly.

Thin-future fantasies. Reliving my wedding, renewing our vows, being a radiant thin bride coming down the aisle, enjoying the church wedding and fabulous reception we didn't choose the first time, proudly displaying those photos.

Photo fantasies. Not hiding in the back row when it's time to take a picture, or trying to do the 'sideways turn' so I don't look so big. Having photos of me with my family that I am not ashamed of or embarrassed to share.

Freedom fantasies. Not planning my life around who will see me out, how I can hide, how I can avoid people and events. Instead, planning my life based on what I think will be fun and worthwhile, no matter how exposed I might be or what new people I might have to meet.

And there's where more fear comes in - because I have tied all these positive feelings into being thin. Like if I'm not thin, I can't be that person. But I CAN. I have to CHOOSE it. I can live that way right now if I want to. Would it be easier, some of it, if I were thin? Yes, of course. But right now I am waiting for my life to start. Wasting precious time. Hiding. Being ashamed of myself.

I want to come out of hiding. I want to live. I WANT - and that is OK!!! I can want things. I DESERVE to have my dreams come true. I am worth it. I am worthy of love and I can love myself and give to myself. I DESERVE TO BE THIN and I don't have to be afraid of it any more. Who cares what people think? Who cares about family parties? They cannot keep me down, and I won't let them.

I do have the power. I have the power to choose what I want and work to achieve it. And I no longer want some stupid food item more than I want my fantasies. The one that really resonates? My kids. The vision of myself running and playing with them, sharing memories and experiences that I never had with my sedentary parents. Quite frankly, the vision of me experiencing childhood WITH them, because I never had one of my own. Being a grown up, but also letting myself go, letting myself just feel and be without judgement, letting myself bask in the love of my husband and kids and knowing to the core that I do not have to feel guilty for receiving that love. That I deserve that love, just because I exist, because God made me, and made these people so that they could love me, and I could love them, and together we could do great things.

This is so - scratch that. I was going to say I was embarrassed or that it was cheesy. Forget that. I am sitting here typing and I am loving everything that is coming out and it is making me cry and I WILL NOT apologize for that or worry what anyone might think. I don't have to be sorry all the time for the mere fact that my presence might have inconvenienced someone. I am me. I am here. I have a purpose and it is to love, to be loved, and to do the best I can with what I am given. I have been given so much. But it is still OK to want more. It is OK to want to be thin, and beautiful, and have experiences and feelings that I have never had before.

Hello. This is me. What you see is what you get. And I don't hide much, do I?

[DutchChoc]

Hi, nickieluv. It's all about choices, that's about all I can say. We can either stick to the plan and eat about 700 cals a day or whatever the likely expectation is of the MF plan, or we can eat a bit more or a lot more by "cheating". The extent to which we "cheat" just biochemically determines when or if we've created enough of a deficit to lose weight. It doesn't make us inherently evil, maybe some would say inherently stupid for those choices, but more power to the people who are following the rules as best they can. I'm not that hung up for myself whether I'm "cheating" because it's always going to be my nature to want to eat - hence, I'm not a stunning example of a "natural thin person".

One would always have to say the MF expectation of 5&1 or 6&0 is truly temporary, just to get a person to the weight they desire - it's just a fast train to get there.

[smartipantz]

Nickie,

I keep reading your journal entries and see the same patterns. You do well for a few days and then blow them, with food we really need to stay way from. Think of it this way, you've lost 12 pounds... but then turn and eat fast food which is probably the worst thing on earth of us. Like several of us, you have a food issue (yes, I do too) but we have to make choices to be healthier. It's not going to come over night. But the rate I was going at and many others, we are on a road to self destruction if we don't change our patterns NOW. Diabetes will raise it's ugly head if we don't stop NOW. You have young children that not only want their Mommy healthy and around when they grow up and I know you don't feel good about yourself. It's amazing how a few lost pounds will make you feel better about yourself.

You know, maybe you need to do a program modification to help you. I'm not sure who your health advisor is, but have a chat with them. What about having two L&Gs, along with your 5 supplements. It's not the exact program, but it's a start to being 100% on program. I know when I have my L&G, I'm full for hours. If you have two, that might keep you from going off the deep end and then feeling badly about yourself. Or if you don't feel good about doing that, have a little more protein than allowed during your L&G.

I don't want you to think this is a rag session on you Nickie, but we really need to get you to a place where you feel in control. Losing 12 pounds is a great accomplishment... don't reward yourself with fast food. If you are hungry, eat another L&G.

Plus........... you are going on vacation really soon. Don't you want to be feeling skinnier and in control?

Hugs!!

Keri

[SuzyQ66]

Hi Nickie -

I am so sorry that you are struggling again. However, you did do it successfully enough to lose 12 pounds. I agree with Keri...you just can't reward yourself with fast food. Instead of looking ahead to vacation, try taking this one day at a time...or even better....two or three hours at a time. Everytime you have supplement, remind yourself that you have 2-3 hours before your next and find something to keep you busy during that time. 2-3 hours is not that long. And maybe chew on a piece of gum. For me it did not get easy after 3 days...it got easier after about 2 weeks. So you just have to get yourself through every 2-3 hours until the easy time starts for you...And I still struggle on some days...but then I go back to getting through every 2-3 hours....it sure beats having to go through the first two weeks again.

I wish there were easy answers Nickie. We are there for you and hope that these struggles subside, at least enough to get you on track. You did this before and you can do it again. Don't give up...remember, you are worth it. You are worth focusing on yourself today...taking care of yourself. Stop beating yourself down.

[DogMa]

I wish my brother could understand all this!! He was complaining AGAIN about having to walk for half an hour a day, like he's the only one who has to exercise to protect his heart.

Even my cousin's husband, who is naturally thin and has always been one of those annoying people who could eat anything without gaining weight is now in his 50s and learning that he has to cut back AND work out to stay that way. In some ways, I think it's harder for him because he's never had to think about what he eats. As opposed to those of us who have been on and off diets most of our lives.

Hang in there, Nicks. What amazes me is that no matter how many times you fall off, you just pick yourself and start fresh. And that IS a good example for your girls (and for everyone here!).

[nickieluv]

Thanks you guys. Good advice from all of you, and the encouragement was really nice to read this morning.

I am starting again today - after starting yesterday and then not eating all day long after the first supplement, and so of course being starving by the end of the day and ordering in. I'm so predictable.

Sunday I restarted, too, only to have my husband eat pizza in front of me at a party, and I used that as an excuse to grab some goodies when I went to the store to pick up an order of photos that had come in.

And yesterday I had the age-old thoughts again of 'wait till after Christmas' - I seem to get those thoughts after a few days of failed restarts, even though it's not really what I want.

My brain is very stubborn. It wants to be mad, I guess, no matter what. If I lose 12 pounds, for example, my brain says 'you lost so much, you can lighten up a little now.' If I gain, say, 6 pounds back, my brain says 'you have no control, you'd better just give up on this diet for now.'

Well I may hold the record for the biggest number of restarts, and the longest amount of time to reach goal (once I get there), but I hold out hope that taking all this time NOW will somehow, miraculously, translate into something helpful when maintenance time finally rears its head.

I am back on today and determined to stay that way. I just need to grow up. I lost 12 pounds in a freakin week, for Pete's sake, and STILL I wanted to lose faster. I think part of me cheated on purpose because then if I had a bad week this week, I could blame it on the cheating instead of being in that place where you lose less, or gain, and can't figure out why because you've been perfectly on plan. At least if I gain this week, I'll know why. So silly.

The thing is, it may be simple, but it's hard. I know all the right things to do, and I can even do them sometimes. That cheating thing is a slippery slope and it's best if I just don't go there in the first place - but I seem compelled to eat something I shouldn't, precisely because I shouldn't.

I will do my 6&0 for the rest of the week, leaving the L&G out of the equation for a little bit until the cravings subside - and I'll get back on the water train today and leave the diet soda alone. Which is actually pretty easy to do when I am drinking all that water, because I'm always due for another glass of water so I don't have the time or the bladder space to drink anything else.

I really do look forward to losing weight. If only because it will unclutter my house when I can toss out the fat clothes and get back into the boxes of things I had when I got under 200. I HATE clutter. I HATE knowing my attic and basement are full of things that I never or seldom use. I force my husband to do a full clean-out with me twice a year and throw things away that haven't been used since the last clean-out. And it will be a great pleasure to remove anything greater than a size 14 from my house, when that time comes.

I have the answer. I know what works. Blah blah blah. Just do it.

[DutchChoc]

Nickie, you are so smart about all this, you know. You know it backwards and forwards and you CAN figure it out and follow your heart. Sounds like you already are doing that, so keep thinking the good thoughts and feeling determined.

[nickieluv]

Hey all.

Thanks for the discussion both here and in Tawanda's journal. I've read it all, and pondered it all, and it's completely 100% right about 'want' vs. 'shoud.'

When I was all gung ho in August, those couple of weeks were great. Effortless pretty much, because I knew what I wanted and I was working towards it. Once I went off for the BF issues, I could not get that feeling back. I lost the excitement and I'm not sure exactly why. But it's not been there. You would think that after a good first week (although even in those seven days I cheated once) I would have gotten some of the fire back, but I didn't.

So I'm taking a couple of days. I'm still very much in the 'should' phase - and there are lots of good 'should' reasons, don't get me wrong. I'm not taking forever, because I do need to lose this weight. But the 'want' is being elusive and I don't seem to be having any success faking it or forcing it. I've had that desire and I know what it feels like, and like Tawanda says, it does make things easier. Fighting every day is tiring.

I know the 'want' will be back, but if I'm wrong, I'll go back to forcing and faking in a few days. Maybe even tomorrow, who knows? I look forward to reading about big Christmas losses and don't think you're getting rid of me - I'm just taking a mental break. That's probably weak-willed of me, or something, but it's what I'm doing. I want to want, and I'm going to see if I can get that back. But for now, I'm going to relax.

[nickieluv]

It is funny how the instant I am officially 'off the diet,' the desire to binge leaves me. I'm still eating, and of course eating too much because that seems to be all I know how to do - but I'm not daydreaming about food and planning constantly what yummy thing I can eat. I'm not shoving food in my mouth so fast all you see is a blur. Interesting.

Still looking forward to starting up again. I think letting myself not be on a diet for a few days is restorative. Also, I'm thinking I may actually have been hungrier than normal a few days ago because TOM was arriving. It takes some getting used to - after each baby my issues surrounding that time seem to change a bit. First my cycle lengthened - with this baby it lengthened even more - and I seem to be having more PMS symptoms. Before I had either baby I was like clockwork at 28 days and never had any cravings or pains or even bloating. Now I'm sitting at 33 days and it's all new territory.

Not that anyone cared about THAT! Glad to see so many losing and staying strong - inspiration abounds here!

[nickieluv]

Debating getting back on program today. Something in me is saying 'not quite yet,' but I know I'll be back on before Christmas. It's just a toss-up whether it will be Sunday or Monday. When I'm not making my life all about food, I can see all the reasons I have for losing weight and improving my health.

Even just losing 12 pounds that first week, I was bounding up the stairs again without being out of breath. Now that 10 of them are back, I'm dragging up the stairs. I'm sure it's not just physical, that drag, but also mental. If I think about it too long I get annoyed with myself and depressed that I am STILL holding on to all this weight and seem determined to do so.

So today is the big family Christmas. I'm determined to just eat one plate, and not pile it to the ceiling, and choose only one dessert - a small piece, and savor it instead of inhale it. I have no such plans about the hors d'oeuvres - kind of forgot about them until just now when I was typing. I can guarantee I won't go nuts with them unless my grandmother makes her no-bake cookies. But even if she does I will allow myself only two, and again, savor them. I know from experience more does not taste any better than one or two, and in fact usually tastes worse.

Tomorrow is the smaller Christmas which may be cancelled due to weather, and there's not another family thing until next week and there's always shrimp at that one every year, so I can do my lean there and take a bag of celery sticks for my green - which has the added advantages of being crunchy and also lasting a long time because you have to chew it so thoroughly, so that can keep me away from the other stuff. They never have the greatest food anyway - I mean, no special holiday treats, just the standard chips and dip and stuff like that. I may be in trouble tomorrow if my Dad does come, and brings his magical Christmas cookies - but I don't believe he bothered to bake this year and those I have the recipe for so I could make them any time if I wanted to. Although I can't make them as good as he can - why is it that you can follow a recipe to the letter and STILL things don't turn out quite right?

The holidays do not have to be about eating. I look forward to next year, when I WILL be at goal (although possibly prego again but I am NOT allowing that to happen until I see 140 on this damn scale) and I can see myself making decisions consistent with my desire to maintain a healthy weight, and basically ignoring the food in favor of playing with the children and enjoying not having to ask people to push in their chairs so I can get by behind them.

Part of me wants to start on plan today - but then I don't think I would STAY on plan, and I don't want to disappoint myself again. So I will be off today, but take it easy and kind of let the 'want' build up in my system. Because it's there. And getting stronger.

[nickieluv]

Oh, and one more fun thing to look forward to - the big reveal. A lot of these people I might not see at all between now and next Christmas - can you imagine how much I would actually look FORWARD to the holidays next year instead of dreading them? I may not like a lot of attention (I say that, but again, I want to get back on stage and I work at jobs that require me to be on display constantly - kind of cross purposes I guess) but I can't imagine not liking oohs and aahs as people admire my newly slim physique. And even better - year after year, keeping that body while the others get bigger and bigger. I know that's awful to say and I don't exactly mean my family when I say that - it's more about those people in the world who have never been even a touch overweight and greatly enjoyed tormenting me for my size, and I kind of hold my breath a little each time I might see those people (OK, one particular person) hoping that he (of course it's a he) has gotten a little beer belly or something. No such luck yet, and he comes from a family of constantly thin people who were never even so much as chubby in their lives so it'll probably never happen, but the in me still dreams of such a day.