The MakeMeThinner Support Forum

[BerkshireGrl]

Ok, this is off-topic, but I thought with all the people reading here and your wide variety of job experiences, you may be able to share what you would do in the situation I find myself. It's a very aggravating one...

I have been at the same job for almost 6 years (anniversary is May 24th.) This is the longest I have worked at one job (my choice luckily, never been fired, but have been very mobile mostly due to school.) I do graphic design for a small firm with about 60 employees in the western part of Massachusetts. There is very little real industry out here, and design jobs are few and far between. Mostly, it is a gorgeous place to live, and tourism is a big deal here. I really enjoy living out here and the only thing I'd like to change is my pay. I get good benefits (medical, dental, 401(k) with a co. match, 3 weeks vacation, 4 sick days) and like most (heheh) of my coworkers.

This job gave me the opportunity to learn design from the ground up, and while I had a good ability to learn software and have an artistic eye, I had zip in the way of an arts degree. So, I got in at the bottom and worked my way up to be a Senior Designer, after working in the Printing and Photoshop depts. This was 6 years of busting my butt, working up to 60 hours, always wanting to know more... and now I get the hard stuff to design. Not too shabby right?

But after 6 years, I am still not cracking $30,000 a year. I get what is usually a delayed "annual" review that results in a $1/hr. raise. So, I started at $9 an hour (yikes) and have slowly got to where I make $13.50. This is with positive reviews all along. An old quote I have from a 2002 job offer is $33,000 to start. I would guess that it's up to $35,000+ now.

I am having a tough time getting along on this pay of $28,080 a year, not counting my overtime. I can, but unless I work weekends, I have no savings, can't fix my car, can't go on vacations, you get the idea. Definitely paycheck to paycheck. And I have a large chunk of credit card debt that I am eager to get rid of, to the tune of a bit over $10,000.

So, I am due soon, I HOPE, to get another review. After 6 years, I now train new people, answer "art director"-type questions all day long, and basically keep things moving along smoothly. I have a more senior team leader who is great, but she is so busy with her niche of auction brochures that more often than not, I am leaned upon to be the "go to" person for arty questions.

Here is my issue. Last week, I found out that a guy in the Photoshop dept., a friend and bandmate of 2 of the 3 bosses, is making what I do. And here is the real rub. He is not a good worker... his photos look bad, he does half a job but misses the rest of the pics, or he saves them where no one can find them. And, he has only been on the job 2 years as opposed to my 6. And this was because he quit after 1 year because he didn't like his night schedule, then was hired back on 2nd shift.

I am having a tough time sucking up the fact that this guy is making my salary yet only has one-third the time on the job, and much, MUCH less responsibility. Yet, this is not knowledge I should legitimately have... he was dumb enough to mention to a coworker what his overtime (time and a half) pay was, and she told me in frustration (since she is also apparently underpaid despite being a great asset to the company.)

Very, very frustrating. What to do? I'm tempted to write my boss a letter (the one in the band of course) and explain my position, how I have worked hard for the company, what responsibilities I now have and how I go above and beyond, and how I deserve to make at least $15 an hour. And soon.

Or should I just suck it up and wait to see when and if I get my review and keep mum about this guy?

The thing is, I like my job, I love design. Admittedly, it can be very stressful there as we are all under a constant deadline, but I think now that the company is under new ownership (much more professional and corporate, since Sept. 2004) that the place is moving in very good directions.

But the nepotism is tough to know about. I knew that under the old owners, it was a fact, and we were in fact told in a company meeting that if we shared what we were paid, we would be FIRED. End of story. So, we all knew that there must have been some serious weirdness with pay going on... and it appears there still is.

This really burns me up. But I feel pinned to the wall. I'm also thinking of obviously looking elsewhere for a job, in design, and just moving. But that is not my most loved solution... I love where I live, family is close by, but maybe it is time to move on to a more challenging position in a more urban area, like Boston/NYC. I've lived all over the country, no big cities though yet... and I hesitate because I feel at home here. Sigh. And also hesitating because I have zero savings to move, and would need to borrow the cash from family, which while possible, is not where I want to go as an adult.

Major soul searching going on... any advice from those who have been there, done that?

Thank you very much!
Sarah

[want2Bthin]

Sarah-

You have quite a big decision to make. It sounds like other then the pay, you really like your job and where you live. There is alot to be said about that. Maybe instead of telling your boss that you know someone else who works there is making what you make and has only been there for 2 years, you could use a different approach. Perphaps you could tell the boss that you are having a hard time making it on your current income but you love working there. You could say that you know other companies are starting out at a much higher salary then what you make. You might want to add that you have been a loyal employee and would hate to have to leave and go else where but you simply will have no choice if you cannot get a higher raise.

I was an administrative assistant for a large national company for years. I did payroll for about 200 employees. At one point my job was turned into 2 jobs when a fellow employee left her position as recruiter. This went on for a year. I tried to suck it up but when my evaluation came around I approached it the way I suggested above. It went great and I got a very good salary increase.

I hope you find peace on how to handle this situation. I would take your time and think it through first. Please let us know how it goes.

Angelia

[doglover]

I have only a couple things to add.
1) don't put it in writing. Could be used against you in the future. Talk to you boss and explain the situation focusing on how YOU are a valuable employee and deserve what you are asking for
2) Get your resume together and send it out! Never know what may come around the corner and you can still work your job while searching
3) Don't settle, but don't discount other aspect of the job that may have "value" to you. 24k was going thru this w/ her job move. Is it all just $$ or are other areas valuable that you may not get anywhere else.

Good luck and my thoughts are with you on this really hard decision.
Donna

[Tk]

I've been in your exact position. I left that job for a better paying one - now 1 year later they are trying to get me back. (I was doing and still am doing Accounts Payable and Accounts Receivable.)



So, they are offering me more money and I am really thinking about going back.

[24KaratGold]

It has been my experience that if ya don't ask, ya don't get. Ask for more -- the worst they can do is say no. Don't present it as an ultimatum though unless you are planning to follow it up. You can explain all the positive reasons why you are worth $33K a year without delving into what you know about this other guy, or without coming right out and stating that otherwise you will be leaving (although it can't hurt, if you have the hard info, to refer to what someone in the industry in a comparable position is making; that will let them know that at least you are aware and may have been looking).

I'll try to come back to this thread later on -- I'm just on a quick lunch break here. However, one of the Mass. lawyers might want to comment on this, if they know:

But the nepotism is tough to know about. I knew that under the old owners, it was a fact, and we were in fact told in a company meeting that if we shared what we were paid, we would be FIRED. End of story. So, we all knew that there must have been some serious weirdness with pay going on... and it appears there still is.

This is seriously illegal in California -- don't know about Mass. -- and the rationale is that in order for people to keep the company honest in not discriminating on the basis of gender, race, etc., employees have some right and interest in knowing what others are making.

[DonicaB]

Sarah~~I have absolutely no advice for you. I have never done anything except teach and we just don't have to deal with those types of issues. So I am clueless when it comes to these types of things. It sounds like you have gotten some very good advice from everyone though.

While I have no advice, I wanted you to know I am thinking about you and praying for you. You will make the right decision.

DonicaB

[LilMsTexas]

Sarah,
While you all know me as a Probation & Parole officer, let me also divuldge that I have a recent Masters degree in Human Resource Management. I am not going to restate what has already been said, but will only say I agree with the advice you have already been given. I'll give you one example that may boost your esteem to stand up for yourself.


I tend to make short stories rather LOOOOOOOONG stories so I'm going to try to cut to the chase here. I decided to go back to work here in VA. Baby was only 4 months old. Didn't HAVE to go to to work but NEEDED to go to work (barely making it). Probation does NOT pay well. I repeat Probation does NOT pay well.......except in the Northern neck of Virginia. I live exactly on the line where the pay cuts down approximately 10-12,000 dollar differential. So......20 miles further north there are officers doing my exact job making 10-12k more than I do. Going north just that few miles would mean leaving my house at 5:00 in the morning and not getting home until probally 6:30 or 7:00 every night. I wasn't willing to sacrifice my family time.

So........when I applied for this job the advertised salary was 26-45K per year. I decided I wouldn't work for less than ??K. I interviewed, was offered a position at ??K. I said "Oh I'm so sorry, but that is less than I am willing to work for.......my education alone requires more money than that but thank you so much for offering me the position. I went on to add that I couldn't afford to pay my student loans that would come out of deferment for that kind of money!" So.......they said well let us check with Richmond and see what we can do. Next day.......came back with ??K but with the knowledge that there would be a 3% raise in December and another 3% state employee raise the next year. I compromised at ??K and then got the raise and the next raise is coming in Dec. Within just a few months I was at the ??K mark I required.

Now......the rest of the story. I have come to learn that I may be the highest paid officer in my office with the exception of 4 Senior officers. There are officers who have been there for 4-5-10 years that I believe are making less than me. WHY? Because they started out low and state employees aren't given raises per se'.

I have NEVER in my life even THOUGHT about bargaining for salary. I have learned through this one situation that my experience is valuable. That if I believe and have proof that I am an asset, people WILL pay you. If they had said no then it would have been up to me to decide if I was willing to compromise but I had nothing to lose.

If you make your case and the answer is "no" they will have to justify in the response to you. At that point you will have to decide if you can continue to live with your situation or if you need to at least investigate other options. BUT........if they say YES.......then you get to stay in your beautiful area and love your job and be happy Either way you will have the satisfaction of knowing you have value to this company and it has been brought to their attention. I do not believe that you have to bring the other employee into the conversation. You simply need to discuss your pay and your dedication to the company and inquire about a higher salary. Truly.......what have you got to lose? They can't fire you for asking for more money

And these are just my two cents. And just think......that was me trying to make it SHORT Sorry about leaving out the exact dollar amounts too. I really don't care if you know what I make. However, there are several people from my work that I'm trying to get on here and this could cause a stink

Whatever you decide........just feel good about it and let it go. If you decide to stay and NOT say something then you have to really be willing to let it go and forget about it. If you decide to stay and CAN'T let this go then you MUST take action!! And know ahead of time what your options are if your outcome isn't what you had hoped for.

CHARGE!!!
Christi